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Post by Kyzrati on Dec 10, 2012 2:27:38 GMT -5
Ah, well, glad you found it! In fact, I was just stopping by now to tell you that I just made a large building with a spiral staircase that goes up to z=3, and it works fine. But obviously you already know that! (Sorry I didn't see your post earlier--the bookmark didn't work for some reason and I wasn't logged in last time I showed up so I didn't notice there was a new post.)
The fact that it won't let you up there if you can't see the spot yet would be normal behavior, since you can't walk somewhere unless you've seen it. If you clear the known map, it won't let you walk anywhere unless you at least turn first and update your FOV!
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Post by 10101 on Dec 10, 2012 2:55:17 GMT -5
Hm. So no spiral stairs in small, dark areas. So the question rises, if it would help to use more windows, some lightsource or if it would help to lower the height-value of the stairbase (aka 'Earth').
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Post by Kyzrati on Dec 10, 2012 3:21:39 GMT -5
It isn't a question of light, it's whether or not the unit has seen a given cell before (within FOV at some point). Light only determines whether units are currently visible at that location (light > 0, for those races that require light to see targets). Your tower looks like it should work fine. My staircase is even more cramped and has no problems that I've discovered so far--works with either mouse or numpad input. Attached the stairwell I'm playing with right now, where 'v' is a sloped stair, and 'S' is a stair base (it originally went up to z=3, but I'm only going to use up to z=2). Attachments:
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Post by 10101 on Dec 10, 2012 12:16:59 GMT -5
Interesting, as i now had the impression that for it to work you have to get some room between the player and the stairbase.
so something like: f v EvS
with E as the Entity, the letters you used and the upper column being the 2nd floor (read: sideview). I seem to have some problems when the entity gets one floor up and then turns around and stands right in front of the next stairbase (like: ES).
But despite of that i made the basement of that tower from 4x4 to 6x6. It works way better now (and also it has a better look).
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Post by Kyzrati on Dec 10, 2012 12:29:12 GMT -5
What kind of problem? In the 'ES' situation you mention, if you're standing on a 'v' and there's another 'v' directly above the 'S', you should be able to go up it according to the sloping rules, no matter how many floors there are.
Your side-view rendition is correct. That's what it looks like, though my example isn't as simple as it could be since I have the staircase wind up in two different directions. Works great. Here are my 'v' and 'S':
"Stone Stairs" v . _ gray_5 "Stone" 0 1 200 60 130 - "Stone Rubble" 1 60 1 1 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 8 0 SLOPE= 0 - "Stone Stair Base" S LDBLCK LDBLCK gray_5 "Stone" 1 1 200 60 130 - "Stone Rubble" 1 60 0 0 1 1 1 1 1 1 0 0 1 NONE 0 -
Edit: Ah, I see your edit now. Glad it's working out better.
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Post by 10101 on Dec 10, 2012 15:21:56 GMT -5
The point is, that i (sometimes) can't see the upper v from the ES situation. I'd have to go into a EvS or EfS Situation to be able to see that v for being able to move there.
For the small 4x4 towerbase that means: I'd have to destroy a window and move there so i can reveal that upper v-cell that otherwise remained black and therefore was a 'invalid move'.
D'OH! Comparing our stairs i realized that my stairs Have a floor-transparency of 0 perhaps that might have been the problem (small number, big difference). Ok, test says it definitly makes the difference. Another day, another lesson ;D
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Post by Kyzrati on Dec 10, 2012 20:53:00 GMT -5
Well, glad we figured that out, but now that you mention it, the floor *shouldn't* be transparent... It doesn't really cause too many problems, since you'll generally have stair bases under stair slopes anyway, and just see that, but when I get back to doing real outside hill slopes it could be a bigger problem.
I believe I noticed this was an issue a long time ago but it only occasionally was an issue since by the time you reached a slope, you'd generally seen the whole thing from some point or another.
The reason my floor was transparent was because I actually copied the original lift-stair values to make my sloping stairs. Oops. Well, I'll leave mine transparent for now, but have to look into the issue again. Not sure if there's an easy way around this given how the FOV calculations work.
EDIT: Yeah, I turned my transparency off and now see exactly what you were seeing, and that it's really only an issue with very narrow stairwells that cause you to be adjacent to another slope when you've just come up from a lower floor--you can't see the next step above because you are right next to it. This is standard behavior for the FOV calculations, and makes sense because according to the engine you are adjacent to a cell that is technically taller than you are, even though it's just stairs going up.
So I suppose the other solution is, as you've done, make the area wider so you'll always see the upper slope from a distance of at least two cells.
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